Surgery Secrets with Dr. Nancy Shipley

Introduction & Quickfire Questions with Dr. Nancy Shipley

[00:00] Hello and welcome to Surgery Secrets, where we go behind the scenes to uncover secrets about surgery you won't hear in the classroom. My name is Isabelle and today we are sitting down with Dr. Nancy Shipley. Let's get started. So we'll begin with some quick fire shots.

[00:20] answer questions. So would you be able to tell us her name? So my name is Nancy Yen Shipley. I'm an orthopedic surgeon. And where do you work? I work in Portland, Oregon in the US. And what does your job entail? So I'm a private practice orthopedic surgeon and

[00:40] I am fellowship trained in sports medicine and arthroscopy so I take care of joints and bones and focus on the shoulder with also knee and a little bit of general orthopedics and bread and butter trauma thrown in. And what's your favorite color.

[01:00] You know, I think that's a good thing. I think that's a good thing. So, so your favorite color is sometimes blue, sometimes green. Today's today's a pink mode mood, obviously. And your favorite food. It would definitely have to be sushi.

Dr. Shipley’s Background: Orthopedic Surgery & Specialties

[01:20] I love Wonder Woman, but I also like Wolverine, so much so that I named my son after the character. That's great. Who's your favorite musical artist? I would say from 90s punk rock. I like the offspring from 90s hip hop. I love Snoop and Big

[01:40] I listen to a lot of Portuguese music. I love music, so I have a lot of favorites out there. I think that's fair. There's so many good ones out there. Your favorite movie? This will surprise some people probably.

[02:00] But like, I would say Ryan Reynolds and pretty much anything he's in cracks me up and I really like Deadpool. That's actually one I haven't seen. So I need to talk about that. What's your favorite organ of the body? Oh, definitely the bones.

[02:20] And the last book you read. Oh gosh. Last book I read is, I think, Adam Grant's Originals. And can you recommend me a TV show.

[02:40] I am only in the first season just getting caught up, but I am loving Ted Lasso. Yes, that's been a favorite from a lot of people so far. All right, so you passed the quickfire around, so we'll get onto the nitty gritty questions. Can you tell us who your biggest influence was, career-wise?

[03:00] I would say. One of my biggest influences in entering medicine in the first place who just needed to utter a couple simple phrases to get me to take that leap to apply to medical school was a dear friend.

[03:20] friend of my family, a dear friend of me. She passed away this year. Interestingly enough, she is the mom of a college ex-boyfriend who I didn't remain in touch with, but she and I remained very, very

Biggest Career Influences & Journey into Medicine

[03:40] close, I consider considered her to be like an ant. And when I didn't think I was good enough, smart enough, whatever to apply to medical school. I asked her what she thought about applying to a number of different types of postgraduate education, I thought about nursing school

[04:00] Do I want to go to PT school? And she said, you can be a physician. Why aren't you applying to medical school? And I remember thinking, oh, you know, I have always been interested in medicine and I just thought that there's anything

[04:20] less about those other professions, but certainly, you know, the path is longer, it's challenging with medical school and residency. And I just, I think I didn't give myself enough credit at the time and then she gave me the nudge. And so that was one of my big inspirations for going into

[04:40] Well, I'm sorry about your loss, but she seems like a great lady and someone really important in your life. She was. So you spoke a little bit about how the path is longer in medical school. Do you have a most memorable moment of growth?

[05:00] What are some of your training. I would say, I think the day that I learned that I matched into orthopedic surgery when I was a medical student was a day that I would never forget. Obviously I was really excited and happy to have gotten admission to medical

[05:20] school in the first place. But when I realized that I wanted to do orthopedic surgery and I couldn't imagine myself doing anything else, it's obviously a competitive field to get into. It's kind of high stress as you're applying and you're doing your rotations and trying to do well while learning.

[05:40] And the day that I found out that I had matched into a program, I didn't really care where at that point. I had already submitted my rank list and I was overjoyed. So that was a really huge and memorable day for me. I also was proposed to on that day.

Memorable Moments: Medical School & Residency Experiences

[06:00] So it's like extra meaningful. And I would say during medical school that was really impactful and a lot of memorable moments throughout my training as a resident. I think there were some times that made me laugh.

[06:20] And sometimes that made me cry. And I mean, overall, I had a really great experience in training. So there are a number of different instances that really stand out. Well, that seems like a really difficult day to compete with with any other.

[06:40] But do you have any recent memorable moments that maybe come close to come close to that one. You know I would say in practice. Sometimes it's the little moments and of course they're the big ones that you'll never forget.

[07:00] Maybe one of the scarier moments that I will never forget and and sometimes you, you need those you need to encounter those to give you humility and to realize just how fragile the human life is.

[07:20] had a patient who went into surgery. It was a proximal humerus fracture. This gentleman had a lot of medical issues. He really wasn't that healthy, but he needed to have surgery. And I was suspicious.

[07:40] of vascular injury and consulted the vascular surgeons and they cleared, so-called cleared him for surgery and stated, you know, we, we didn't, they did the studies and they said, there's no way they said there's no way he has an arterial bleed. And, um,

[08:00] In the OR made the incision as I usually do and I wasn't very deep into the incision and just clearing out some of the clot that was there, all of a sudden it was a geyser. And, you know, in orthopedics I think

[08:20] Especially, you know, I do shoulders I do sports medicine. I take care of fractures, but in general, in orthopedics among the surgical fields. We don't often have those situations in the OR where all of a sudden, there are now 25 people in the room.

[08:40] And two or three anesthesiologists and you know everybody's everybody's rushing in. So this gentleman was crashing. And, you know, he had an axillary artery bleed that was undetected. It probably clotted off and the vascular surgeons didn't catch that.

[09:00] didn't think there was one. And so all I could do was put my finger on it. I couldn't see it. It was too deep. And eventually we had the cardiothoracic surgeon break scrub from surgery next door and came in and you know,

High-Stakes Surgery: A Life-Threatening Case in the OR

[09:20] ended up ended up preparing it. And the guy survived. He was in his late 90s. And we think even because of his immigration years ago, the date of birth wasn't accurate. We think he actually was two years older than he was. So he was

[09:40] already well into his late 90s and he was even older, but he pulled through and it's kind of moments like those that really make you say, oh, you know, you learn from that and when your gut tells you that, okay,

[10:00] Okay, we need to look deeper into this. It's, it's a good thing to listen to and so, you know, that's that's definitely one of those things that you will never forget like I actually see the anesthesiologist that I was working with that day all the time and and we still talk about it it's a case that he would never forget either.

[10:20] And so, you know, I think that certain things like that will will stand out in training and both in practice and it's things like that that will shape how you continue to evolve and change your practices, you know, and I think.

[10:40] I don't think I would have necessarily done anything different in surgery, but I think that there was a little bit of me that was really worried preoperatively and maybe I should have pushed harder, you know, in investigating that. So yeah, I would say that's definitely one of the

[11:00] most impressionable incidents that had happened in practice and lots of really good memories too lots of really good standout memories that are hard to pick those moments kind of happen, you know, day to day, sometimes. I mean, not many people

[11:20] get to be in your position or even like understand what that's like to be in a surgical room and have that happen. Is there one thing or maybe there might be a couple of things that people around you that aren't in medicine just don't understand about your job.

[11:40] I think one thing that people don't understand, and for me, being married to someone who's also in medicine has been great for the both of us because we understand

[12:00] And that it's not something where you can just clock out and that your work oftentimes stays with you and not that I don't know how or that I don't give myself time for self care and dedicate time for my family but when you're really worried about something

[12:20] You're thinking about a patient or you got a big case coming up. It's always kind of there. And, you know, I think as a surgeon and a wife and a mom, you have to set up your personal life and your relationships such that there's

Balancing Surgery, Family, and Personal Life

[12:40] And sometimes it's not. And, and you kind of have to have a, like, especially with childcare, you have to have a deep lineup and you have to have people who are flexible that are willing to take care of one of your most precious people.

[13:00] positions at home and keep them safe so that you don't have to worry about that while you're at work, taking care of your patients and your patients that need your full focus at that time. So you kind of have to, we always have to compartmentalize our different

[13:20] parts of our lives, even though that, you know, they kind of flow into each other. And, and you have to also really rely on having a good village in the in the setting of being a parent and a surgeon to kind of make sure you're doing things right in

[13:40] all the arenas. It sounds, I mean, I can't put myself in, I can't even imagine what that's like, but it sounds like a lot of work. I mean, it is. It is, but you know, I think

[14:00] as physicians and surgeons, those of us that go into training have a certain level of learning how to study and being organized and kind of planning ahead. We're all kind of a little bit type A. And so it sort of takes some of that extending into our personal lives as well to

[14:20] to make sure things are in order to make sure you always have a plan A and a plan B and a plan C. It's like maybe borderline neurotic but it's kind of how one has to be if they're going to be juggling these multiple roles. So what would you say is the absolute best

[14:40] part of your job? I think the best part of my job is restoring function. My favorite time with a patient, obviously I enjoy the work up and I enjoy the surgery. Obviously I love the surgery because I'm a surgeon, but my favorite moment

[15:00] And so what I do with the patient is actually when I say, okay, we're all done. You don't need to come back for follow-up, you know, go do what you're going to go do and, and you know where to find me if you need me. And it's, you know, it's kind of like one of the happiest goodbyes when you finally discharge a patient from your practice.

[15:20] They have finished their ACL rehab. They've finished their rotator cuff rehab. They're back to no restrictions. They're back to sport. And it's because the work that you have done as a surgeon together with others like the physical therapist, like the patient themselves and the

[15:40] And the blood, sweat and tears that they've put in have all kind of culminated in this like really happy goodbye and a goodbye back to normal life. So that's definitely one of the most rewarding parts of taking care of patients in this

Challenges in Medicine: Paperwork, Insurance, and Patient Care

[16:00] So I guess in the other end of that, what would you say is the worst part of your job? The worst part of the job is most definitely paperwork. I've gotten that one a lot. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, it's kind of a necessary part of our work.

[16:20] work and documentation and filling out forms. But, you know, it takes us away from the actual care of our patients. I think navigating, jumping through the hoops of insurance authorizations instead of trusting physicians to make

[16:40] And so that's definitely the hardest part and the worst part. Yeah, I interviewed.

[17:00] yesterday and and it was the same answer. We have a lot of work to do in fixing our profession, you know, it's a great profession. It's a calling obviously, but there, there are a lot of things that need to be fixed.

[17:20] So in terms of your practice, you kind of told the story earlier of the kind of big kerfuffle during surgery. Have you had any other moments that have been like the weirdest or messiest or kind of, yeah, the weirdest thing that's ever happened to you at work?

[17:40] I would say maybe one instance, a couple instances that stand out along those lines usually involve taking care of patients who maybe have ideals that are contrary to yours.

[18:00] And, you know, and I think that we are hearing and seeing a lot of this among the voices of physicians and others in healthcare right now who are kind of hitting the wall in the pandemic and trying to dig deep to

[18:20] They're not paying on to empathy when they're taking care of individuals who have chosen to not be vaccinated, but are critically ill, and you know and we're expected to be empathetic and compassionate all the time.

[18:40] You see a lot of that but that you know that's a little bit of an aside to your question. To get back to that. I will say that I have taken care of patients where you know staring at me in the face right next to where I'm making the incision.

[19:00] are tattoos are Nazi tattoos. You know white nationalist KKK tattoos. And, you know, that doesn't really come up in discussion, but it's, you know, like I've had to just completely put aside

Navigating Ethical Dilemmas in Surgery

[19:20] And I was able to do that by judgment in those situations and still recognize that I had taken an oath to take care of human beings and that this is still a human being in front of me, and that clinically I treat them no different.

[19:40] And I think that's one of the things where, you know, I'm a human also. So it's always, you kind of like. You're taken aback when you see it and you're like, whoa. You know? But then you sort of have to.

[20:00] And so I'm here to sort of snap out of that and just say, okay, I'm here to take care of those patients and treat them the same regardless. But, you know, just kind of going back to healthcare professionals in this pandemic, as we're kind of seeing third wave, fourth wave,

[20:20] We are starting to see that crack and we're starting to see that fatigue set in where people are really just getting broken down and starting to feel pretty angry about something that could have been preventable. So, you know, I think that's the challenge in healthcare is

[20:40] is sort of putting personal feelings aside and and we're starting to see that with something as massive and wide reaching as the this pandemic that healthcare professionals are starting to really feel tough doing that.

[21:00] It definitely has been a struggle for healthcare workers with this pandemic I can imagine. You spoke earlier about kind of your family and your support system and kind of during these, these hard times. I assume that a support system is really needed.

[21:20] support system. I draw support from my husband, from my kiddo, and from my friends and also my colleagues, my partners in my clinic. So I just make sure that I try to build a good support system around me and

[21:40] And make sure that I'm being reciprocal about it as well and supporting them back. There are a number of tough times that I would have had trouble making it through alone and it's just sometimes good to have somebody to talk things through with and so the support system has been great for me.

[22:00] through all of my training and my practice, and even more so in the last year and a half. So when you were in school, I guess, medical school or even before medical school, did you imagine yourself living your current life.

[22:20] I think it's, you know, I constantly surprise myself. I didn't have a straight line going into medicine. I took several years off between undergrad and medicine. And, you know, I'm not sure I knew what I was doing when I was 21.

Alternate Career Paths: Storytelling, Podcasting, and Filmmaking

[22:40] I worked in the snowboarding industry because I thought that was cool and fun and just trying to figure out, you know, what I wanted to do when I was ready to start adulting. And, you know, and it was just sort of a roundabout route to realize, hey, I actually think I do want to be a adult.

[23:00] And so I think that's a really good thing. And I think that's a really good thing. I think that's a really good thing.

[23:20] training and you say, okay, I've made it. Like you have to keep looking at ways to grow. And, you know, even if that is staying within the medical field, you know, there are things that you can do to make sure that you're still learning and growing and kind of paying attention to your personal

[23:40] development. So if you weren't doing your current job, what career do you think you'd most like to do? Well, you know, I think I'm already starting to do it. But simultaneously and sort of juggling both realms. I really, in

[24:00] I've been a part of the podcast for a long time. And I've been a part of the podcast for a long time.

[24:20] always appreciated comedy and I've always appreciated making other people laugh. It actually brings me so much joy. And I think I lost that for a while because I was like on this straight narrow path to medicine and training and you know in medicine sometimes it you know needs to be super serious right we can't be cracking

[24:40] jokes when we're talking to people about cutting into them. And in recent years, I've kind of rediscovered that and figured out how to also make that part of my passion and part of my work. And so being a podcaster, doing my writing and

[25:00] And also working on my first documentary series, which I'm doing now has really tapped into that creative side of me, the side of me that really wants and needs to be a storyteller and an entertainer. And so I think I'm already kind of dipped in my

Final Advice: Passion, Fun, and Longevity in a Surgical Career

[25:20] toes into that alternate thing if I weren't able to practice medicine. Well, that's so exciting that you get to do both. Yeah, very lucky. So I guess we've reached our last question here. If you could go back, what advice would you give your younger self or son?

[25:40] someone to consider in your career? I think I would say make sure you continue to follow your passions. And even though this is a lot of hard work to get from point A to point B, for

[26:00] example, in a surgical specialty, make sure you hang on to having fun. Even in working hard, there should be an undercurrent of your work that is fun to you. And I think in non

[26:20] When I talk to non-medical people, they don't always understand or appreciate that that surgeries can be really fun. Yes, we are trying to restore function. We're making incisions. We're trying to protect the important structures that we don't want to have.

[26:40] want to get into while we're repairing or reconstructing the structures that we do want to. I think it's important to hang on to the fun part of it, it has to light you up, you have to enjoy it. Otherwise, this career is not worth pursuing. Well, thank you so much.

[27:00] Dr. Shipley for joining us today on Surgery Secrets. It was a pleasure to have you join our series. Thank you. It was a pleasure being on. And there you have it. Join us next time for another exclusive look into surgery today. Follow us on LinkedIn for new Surgery Secrets episodes and check us out on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter.

[27:20] For more information on Surgery 101, head to our website, surgery101.org. Thanks again, and we'll see you next time.